LEAF CHARGER PROJECT

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Rory166
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LEAF CHARGER PROJECT

Postby Rory166 » Thu May 22, 2014 10:45 am

Hi All

I am just about to collect a 2014 pre registered LEAF. This comes without the 6.6 Kw optional charger but thankfully with the DC input. These are 850 and 500 pound options.

It occurs to me that a useful accessory would be a 43Kw 3 phase charger to plug into the DC socket. This would extend the number of fast charging stations available. As there probably is no such thing available I thought I might design one. The method of charge state monitoring is unknown to me but I suspect it merely relies on pack total voltage. It may be more sophisticated but not sure.

Anyone having useful information please feel free.

The source of the DC plug would be useful, probably ridiculously expensive if j1772 and manakees are anything to go by. Some sort of display of charge state would be required, or perhaps the car display would work?

A simple set voltage and current limited power supply design would suffice. Of course there would be high voltages and currents to contend with.

Rory
Electric Seicento conversion, Leaf

Grumpy-b
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Re: LEAF CHARGER PROJECT

Postby Grumpy-b » Thu May 22, 2014 11:50 am

It uses a Chademo charger. And the details of the charge sequence, but more importantly the communications protocols are not published, and the only way to get the data is to buy into the chademo system. Very expensive and not one that individuals have so far done. Having joined the system, you are bound by a non disclosure requirement, hence the lack of data on the charge communication protocols. With out the communications, you cant charge the car using the Chademo socket.
Good luck, but I fear you are not going to get too far. Chademo chargers (3phase ) were around £10k last time I looked at this.

Grumpy-b

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Rory166
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Re: LEAF CHARGER PROJECT

Postby Rory166 » Thu May 22, 2014 12:41 pm

Thanks Grumpy-B

So the car will not charge without the Chademo command to charge.

Well I suppose that puts paid to that idea. Perhaps that is why the EU plan to outlaw the Chademo system apparently?

Rory
Electric Seicento conversion, Leaf

genawin
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Re: LEAF CHARGER PROJECT

Postby genawin » Thu May 22, 2014 1:13 pm


Grumpy-b
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Re: LEAF CHARGER PROJECT

Postby Grumpy-b » Thu May 22, 2014 2:14 pm

In the us they have adopted a ham fisted version of the J1772 with an extra set of pins below the std J1772, its a big socket, but does bulk and normal charge in the same socket, ie the std J1772 will fit in the upper half, and it shares the data handshake with the lowere half for the high curren version. SAE in the states charge a musch less cost for the handshake data protocols. But its a limited option and hasnt been taken up in quantity. There are now hundreds more Tesla Supercharger stations in the US so soon it will be a Tesla v the rest challenge in the states. Chademo wont go open source or let companies adopt without the high cost, so there are few manufacturers of their kit. But Nissan have been spreading them out through certain of their european dealers for some time.The EU is trying to go it alone with yet another system and make it more open. But that then means that Japanese, Chinese, or American cars will have to be re-engineered for europe.Its a mess.
The vehicle end is also a mess, with europe opting for all charge outlets having the Type 2 Menekes style socket, many cars still have the J1772 inlet some have the matching Menekes vehicle inlet. SO the renault van has the J1772, but the Zoe Car has the euro socket.
Its also made it a bit of a mess with charging points. All of the earlier ones had J1772 with a plug and tethered lead, but most now just have a post with a socket, so to use them you need the appropriate type 2 lead for your car.
One day it will im sure settle down, but not just yet.
Im sure someone will produce a chademo compatible charger, I have seen one in a video clip, where someone has supposedly reverse engineered the protocols, so they can claim not to have infringed the rights of the Chademo group.

Grumpy-b

Grumpy-b
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Re: LEAF CHARGER PROJECT

Postby Grumpy-b » Thu May 22, 2014 2:22 pm




SO thats around $3to $4k for the charger control unit, the power source, and the cable.

with transport duties and VAT £3to4K in the UK

Its chalenging for anyone to see a suitable market in the UK, as access to three phase isnt easy or common, unless you are a commercial site or in agriculture. I looked at three phase about 15years ago for my house and the big problem was that most of the streets dont have three phases running down, thankfully I have a line at the bottom of my garden so getting it to my workshop would have been relatievly easy, but the cost was thousands.

This is the Chademo "bylaws" that a member has to agree to.
http://www.chademo.com/wp/wp-content/up ... /Bylaw.pdf


Grumpy-b
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Europe Chademo points by country
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Rory166
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Re: LEAF CHARGER PROJECT

Postby Rory166 » Thu May 22, 2014 4:28 pm

e motor werkes seem to make most of their stuff open source. It will be interesting to see what the component cost may be.

Rory
Electric Seicento conversion, Leaf

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Rory166
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Location: Norwich, UK

Re: LEAF CHARGER PROJECT

Postby Rory166 » Mon May 26, 2014 4:45 pm

New thought. Would it be possible to make a three phase 40KVA charger and connect it straight to the battery thus bypassing the chademo circuit entirely?

Rory
Electric Seicento conversion, Leaf

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retepsnikrep
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Re: LEAF CHARGER PROJECT

Postby retepsnikrep » Mon May 26, 2014 5:13 pm

Problem is your car is brand new and under warranty and battery fiddling charger bypassing will likely invalidate all that.
Regards Peter

Two MK1 Honda Insight's. One running 20ah A123 Lithium pack. One 8ah BetterBattery Nimh pack.
One HCH1 Civic Hybrid running 60ah A123 Lithium pack.

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Rory166
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Re: LEAF CHARGER PROJECT

Postby Rory166 » Mon May 26, 2014 7:13 pm

Peter

Point well made. The chademo option will be preferable from that angle and I did buy 2 extra years warantee as well. Hopefully Nissan dont monitor this website to see what I am up to!

So back to the chademo option. Will have to see about getting a set of PCBs made to start with. I can see this thing being a godsend when leafs start queing for hours to use a chademo. Peter I hope you are retired long before the first fight between leaf owners over que jumping!

Rory
Electric Seicento conversion, Leaf


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