New Th!nk website

Do you own or use a EV. Then this is a good place to discuss things.

UK: Smart EV or New City Th!nk?

Smart
0
No votes
Think
5
56%
Both
3
33%
Unsure
1
11%
Neither
0
No votes
 
Total votes: 9

Julia Pigworthy
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New Th!nk website

Postby Julia Pigworthy » Fri May 25, 2007 8:48 pm

moved posting
Saw the film. You know which one. Now I'm strangely at odds with my own car..

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ChrisB
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Postby ChrisB » Fri May 25, 2007 9:46 pm

Hi Julia

I think it depends on what you want out of the vehicle.
The Smart is very tough little cookie, I dont know about the Th!nk.

As for your comments re-tax,MOT, etc dont think owning a EV will make it exempt from these for ever , as soon as theres enough of them about I bet ya the .gov will soon start taxing the living daylights out of them when theres enough money in it :cry:

By the way hope you dont mind but I moved your post into general cars forum :wink:

ChrisB
I reject reality and substitute my own !!!!!!

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floydster
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Postby floydster » Fri May 25, 2007 9:59 pm

ChrisB wrote:The Smart is very tough little cookie


I had a Smart years ago before they were officially being sold in the UK. I was in quite a serious accident but looking at the car you'd think it had been clipped in a car park. A very tough little car indeed. I'd have another any day.

Here's a couple of pictures: -

http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2746395 ... 9096sPoEeG
http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2008913 ... 9096yBUIGV


Floydster

Julia Pigworthy
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EV incentives temporary

Postby Julia Pigworthy » Fri May 25, 2007 10:12 pm

I absolutely agree that the early incentives such as low/zero tax, no congestion charge, et al, will vanish as people cotton on to the petrol car money trap and the EV escape route. They may well introduce a tax on 'transportation electricity' for EV users, although that would also beneficially push people into home micro-generation so that they can genertae the power they use and become almost independent of the national grid in the decades ahead, and not just independent of fuel merchants like petrol stations. Exactly why they want to charge per mile rather than per litre of petrol - they can see which way the wind is blowing and dont want to lose their petroleum smeared golden egg. Once they do this any pretense about "taxing pollution to encourage green transportation" will be revealed for the blatant stealth tax that road charging was always intended to be.
Still, if we can vote with our wallets for battery powered cars instead of the oil cartels in the middle east and america, we can also vote out the party that taxes us just for moving from place to place, and vote for a flatter tax party like UKIP that is basically the only right wing party available to the electorate that isnt a fascist nazi party. My guess is that their desire for restoring independance from Europe will extend to an independent energy policy that would favour plugin battery vehicles over cars that usually drink foreign oil.

Finally thanks for moving the post to the General Cars forum - I belatedly realised it was in a post about the Berlingo and didnt know how to move it, nor could I find it again lol!
Saw the film. You know which one. Now I'm strangely at odds with my own car..

Julia Pigworthy
Posts: 27
Joined: Fri May 25, 2007 5:09 pm
Location: Leeds, UK

Smart crash piccies

Postby Julia Pigworthy » Fri May 25, 2007 10:21 pm

Looks like it took the impact well, albeit a 30mph one. Transit vans are not to be trifled with in a bump, but the solid steel frame mentioned in the Corsa vs SmartForTwo in a 70mph crash on YouTube seems to do its job well. If the Th!nk and Smart are about equal on performance then it may well boil down to crash protection as the deciding factor. That plus the SmartEV looks more aggressive than the Th!nk, which seems more of a soft, fluffy and loveable funmobile. Guess we need someone to crash it at 62mph into a wall to compare it to the Smart.
Saw the film. You know which one. Now I'm strangely at odds with my own car..

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aminorjourney
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Postby aminorjourney » Sat May 26, 2007 6:10 am

I would vote for the Th!nk probably because if it's as good as it is meant to be (especially with the Tesla Battery partnership) they could use as much customer support as they can. I've heard lots of rumors from lots of different places that the smart EV is a bit of a red herring and that they'll not produce it commercially. I hope the rumors are wrong!

Julia Pigworthy
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Is Smart's EV gonna be mainstream?

Postby Julia Pigworthy » Sat May 26, 2007 8:54 pm

You may be right, but Th!nk are gonna lease the battery so although it makes sense to protect the consumer from high battery replacement costs it still keeps control over the EV safely in the hands of the car company and essentially replaces our 80 quid a month petrol cost with an 80 quid a month battery cost. Battery replacement costs should be treated like a potential depreciation cost, with basic guarantees for 3-5 years over performance, etc. That way if the battery lasts for 25 years you dont have to keep buying it every month and the consumer is finally unhooked from a corporation retaining ownership of your car's fuel supply.

Dunno what Smart will do with their EV, I know they intend to trial it with commercial users only before offering them to the public, so Joe Public might not be able to get hold of one, probably because of the need to invest in an expensive fast charger to make the cars viable. But if a nationwide courier or other nationwide company adopted the Smart EV (or any EV for that matter) and set up a corporate network of fast chargers for their fleet, they could conceiveably become a sort of precursor network of fast charging sites nationwide that could eventually offer public charging services for a moderate fee (could be lucrative long term especially if they go the solar/wind powered route). Early adopters of private EVs could speak to any commercial entities who invest in a nationwide charging infrastructure to negotiate usage of the facility, and then the companies would quickly catch on to the potential of stealing the custom of the gas stations. Gas stations would be forced to include one or more fast charging outlets alongside their pumps to get a piece of the action, and it would snowball nicely from there.
Here's hoping.
Saw the film. You know which one. Now I'm strangely at odds with my own car..

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aminorjourney
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Postby aminorjourney » Sat May 26, 2007 9:00 pm

Oh yes, I sure hope so! I do like smart cars!

In fact, I wanted to take part in the trial, until I found out how much they wanted :(

It was, (if I remember correctly) a downpayment of £2,000 plus a monthly rental fee of £375 a month for four years. I think it worked out to about £22,000 all told when you put the charging stuff and taxes on board.

That I could maybe have handled if the payments were £75 less a month - but the car at the end of the four-year period had to go back to Smart, with no option to buy.

Sadly I don't have that sort of capital to invest in that way, so I had to duck out and go for a CityEl. :cry: Still, I wouldn't be without it now!
Nikki Gordon-Bloomfield

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Julia Pigworthy
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Whos about to kill the Smart EV? Maybe Smart..

Postby Julia Pigworthy » Sat May 26, 2007 9:16 pm

£2000 + £375/month for 4 years, after which Smart take back the car with no option to buy sounds like an attempt to protect their petrol car revenues to me. Its GM's EV1/Toyota's Rav4 EV all over again. We need to go on question time and get a major politician to pledge their party will mandate selling EVs in the UK for anyone wanting to sell cars here just like they did in California. If they did that Toyota could resurrect their late 90s 125mile range Rav4 EV RIGHT NOW, with more modern batteries and better technology to boost it's already decent range/speed. But they never will if they can legally sell 100% of their cars without having to offer any plug-in electric option that negates the need to switch on their clanking, high-maintenance, expensive ICEs. Gits.
Saw the film. You know which one. Now I'm strangely at odds with my own car..

goochmeister
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Postby goochmeister » Mon Jun 25, 2007 8:06 pm

Hi Julia.
As far as safety is concerned the >2007 smart has a NCAP rating of 2 stars rising to 3 for the 2007> IC model.Will this remain the same or maybe they wont even test it . dont forget this is a converted car and has many compromises.

The Think on the other hand sailed through the NCAP with a 4 star, only missing 5 stars on the pedestrian impact test due to a high windsheild wiper mounting which I believe to be corrected. It also has a 2+2 seating arrangement, WIFI capabilities and exchangable battery technologies.
Not to mention the fact that you will actualy be able to buy it as a member of the public.

6 week ago Zytek still had a factoy full of gliders!

What about the 2 AND 4 seat Microcar? maybe the styling isn't so hot but it's pretty good especially with the glass roof and the proposed price!!!


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